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MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam

Posted by BertFromProtoneer 
MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 14, 2012 12:52AM
Hi there,

I recently bought some OpenBeam aluminium extrusions from Terence at Openbeamusa.com.

Openbeam started as a Kickstarter project with the aim of making aluminium extrusions
that take normal M3 nuts instead of the hugely expensive t-nut system that most extrusions use these days.
(15x15mm anodized aluminium extrusion, made in the USA)

Would anyone be interested in making a MendelMax / Rostock machine with these extrusions.

What can I offer:
  • I can provide Openbeam @ $15/Meter. (Terence asked me to be the local distributor)
  • I can provide a bag of M3 nuts and bolts at my cost. Cheap as chips!!!
  • I will cut the extrusions to length for you.
  • I can 3d Print all the modified parts for you in ABS/PLA at my cost. (You can even pick the colour)
  • I can provide a naked Ramps 1.4 PCB. (Just the PCcool smiley
  • I can ship the items in NZ for a reasonable price.
  • The rest of the parts you will have to provide yourself.

What would I like in return:
  • I would like the build to be properly documented so more people can take advantage of OpenBeam.
  • Lots of photo's needs to be taken... smiling smiley
  • I will need CAD help with the design of the printed parts

I am a huge fan of OpenBeam and would like to see the prices come down in NZ/AU. But this can only be done
if more people use it. To assist with this I am adding tools to Thingiverse.com that can help with the use of Openbeam.
Please have a look at my Thingiverse.com Profile for more details.

If you are interested or have some questions, please send me a PM or just ask the questions on this thread.

Kind regards,
Bert.




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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 14, 2012 02:34AM
Kindly post some photos and the profile of these extrusions . .thanks
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 14, 2012 10:49AM
I have attached profile details on the extrusion. Thanks for the interest. smileys with beer




Attachments:
open | download - 7524275616_befcc82dbe_z.jpg (76.8 KB)
open | download - 7701413718_1a4ebd476d_c.jpg (87.1 KB)
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 14, 2012 02:48PM
Like the look of this, I might have a play with a mini MendelMax if you like. These would be about $90 per printer at your rates above which is about as much as you could charge I reckon. I am mid-build of a Mendel Max using chinese extrusions which are slightly cheaper for the lot via a slow boat so this is comparable.
Two questions, 1). is it going to continue to be available? and b). can I get a sample of the extrusion?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/14/2012 02:58PM by Wired1.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 14, 2012 10:19PM
Availability is not an issue... we have a good partnership with the manufacturer and if sales continue on as it is doing now we will be able to push the prices down even more.

Send me a PM with your details and I will send you a short piece to play around with. winking smiley


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 16, 2012 03:15AM
Fantastic!!! I have been contemplating this very idea for the last few days. Found your shop over the weekend and been weighing up the idea of building ether a MendalMax 1.5 crossed with a Mendel Prism 1.5 or a RostockMax both using openbeam. Leaning toward a Mendel/Prism/Max 1.5 as this is my first full DIY 3D printer build (built a makerbot cupcake - but that doesn't count). I wish to make something robust to get a reliably decent print quality then from there I will likely print and build a rostockmax.. plus in the time it takes me to complete that build the crazy popularity of the rostock will have resulted in some streamlining of the design. Over the next few months loads of makers will get there builds working and it should be a little less experimental by then. I have ordered 50% of the parts required over the last few days so will start my build in around 2 weeks.

I would require 5meters of open beam or 10 pieces all cut to 400mm

What I can offer is extensive coverage of the build process with high quality, well lit and framed photos and videos. I will be blogging and vlogging every single step.

However my CAD skills are still pretty noob so can't currently help a huge amount on that front, but I learn very quickly so will be starting to investigate the required modifications over the next few days.

I would be very interested and excited to take you up on your offer!
I'm located in Auckland

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/16/2012 03:19AM by Inventive.
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 17, 2012 01:26AM
Thanks for the interest.

Wired1 has already taken up the offer and I can help you and one more interested person.(3 projects in total)

I can cut the extrusions or ship the full length for you. For me it is easier to ship the cut down extrusions but its up to you.

Don't worry to much about the CAD skills it builds up as you make more stuff. I started out with very simple designs and I
am now able to do so complex designs. One thing I have discovered is that there is a huge difference between creating pretty CAD designs and designing practical parts that are easy to manufacture.

3d printing is also a great hands on process to get you into the mind set.

smiling smiley I have also been helping out Joshua with his Delta Printer. He has a great build log of his progress and he is also a great CAD designer. Have a look at his blog for more details: http://www.joshendy.net/ and http://www.cnc4everyone.com/


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 18, 2012 12:12PM
So Bert sent me a sample of the extusion and I have begun roughing out my printer design plus I have been experimenting with printing connecting pieces from PLA. The design will be posted on my blog in a day or two so there's no point trying to keep it a secret, basically I'm building a Prism with a standard 200x200 heated bed and hopefully about 150mm build height.

I needed to do enough of the design to be able to work out how much extrusion I need to build it. The standard Mendel Prusa takes a little under 6 metres of threaded rod and a Mendel Max takes about 6 metres of aluminium extrusion so the best guess 6 metres which I ordered Wednesday and will probably arrive today if I'm lucky.
The way my brain works I need to see and feel it before I can build anything smiling smiley

Right then, I spent about four hours last night figuring out how to use WordPress to start a blog on this project. The results are on my signature panel below so have a look and be supportive or at least discrete smiling smiley I hope to update it every few days as I get the time to work on this new printer so check back periodically if you wish to follow the progress.
Open beam Prism blog

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/18/2012 12:20PM by Wired1.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 18, 2012 08:36PM
Thanks Bert!
Nearly completed/ decided on my design. So will PM you an exact order and plan of attack in the next few days.
More than happy for you to cut it for me as it helps me out and as you mentioned is preferable for you shipping wise.
Will likely be 8 x 400m + 2 x 500mm

Ive started using 123D and SketckUp.. Definitely getting my head round it which is exciting and motivating : )
Been follow joshendys blog for the last few weeks.. That is one inspiring young man!!!

Awesome stuff Wired1, I'm super glad you have also decided to build the Prism. I will be following your endeavors closely as this is my first full DIY build so it is a huge comfort to have an experienced person building the same thing in parallel to me.

Question... have you investigated the Prism 1.5 ??? The design is a nice halfway between a MendelMax and Prism 1.0, based on what I just read on your blog this sounds like it incorporates the modifications you are intending to make. Such as using 2 Z motors and moving them outside the frame. I am also looking at using a 1204 ball screw Z axes from BST Automation on aliexpress.com. Likely going to use 10mm linear rod for x,y and z. Plus Air Trippers Bowden extruder and a JHead.

It was modified and detailed by 'akhlut': [forums.reprap.org]

His Blog detailing the build can be found here: [myhomelessmind.blogspot.co.nz]

Prism 1.5 Printables can be located here: [github.com]
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 18, 2012 10:51PM
That looks good!!! I have subscribed to your blog as well... smileys with beer

What I like about Openbeam is that its like Lego's for makers!!!

You use standard link plates, 3D print links, laser cut perspex links ,
you can even CNC aluminium plates or plasma cut steel plates.

The options are many. Now comes the fun part... Being creative!!!


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 18, 2012 11:11PM
Hi INVENTIVE...

Take your time. When you are ready to go let me know and I will cut+send.

Regarding 123D and SketckUp you only need to know a few steps:
  1. Think of the part
  2. Draw the part
  3. Print the part
  4. Learn from the printed part
  5. Go back to step one

Don't you just love it?!?!?!? I takes only a few month to learn how to do
things you have only dreamed of.

I have always been into making stuff but I have never been so able to express
myself through the things I make. 3D printing is changing the world just like
the internet did a few decades ago. (I am happy to be a small part of it smiling smiley

Inventive Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks Bert!
> Nearly completed/ decided on my design. So will PM
> you an exact order and plan of attack in the next
> few days.
> More than happy for you to cut it for me as it
> helps me out and as you mentioned is preferable
> for you shipping wise.
> Will likely be 8 x 400m + 2 x 500mm
>
> Ive started using 123D and SketckUp.. Definitely
> getting my head round it which is exciting and
> motivating : )
> Been follow joshendys blog for the last few
> weeks.. That is one inspiring young man!!!
>
> Awesome stuff Wired1, I'm super glad you have also
> decided to build the Prism. I will be following
> your endeavors closely as this is my first full
> DIY build so it is a huge comfort to have an
> experienced person building the same thing in
> parallel to me.
>
> Question... have you investigated the Prism 1.5
> ??? The design is a nice halfway between a
> MendelMax and Prism 1.0, based on what I just read
> on your blog this sounds like it incorporates the
> modifications you are intending to make. Such as
> using 2 Z motors and moving them outside the
> frame. I am also looking at using a 1204 ball
> screw Z axes from BST Automation on
> aliexpress.com. Likely going to use 10mm linear
> rod for x,y and z. Plus Air Trippers Bowden
> extruder and a JHead.
>
> It was modified and detailed by 'akhlut':
> [forums.reprap.org]
>
> His Blog detailing the build can be found here:
> [myhomelessmind.blogspot.co.nz]
>
> Prism 1.5 Printables can be located here:
> [github.com]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/18/2012 11:13PM by BertFromProtoneer.

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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 19, 2012 02:47AM
I'll be following your build with interest too Inventive. Yes I have seen the Prism in all it's variations and I like the overall concept which is why I am building an Open Beam version of it. I won't be copying it exactly as such - no fun in that - just the basic design.

I spent the day recycling photocopiers so not a lot of progress but I did manage to make a mitre box for 45 as well as 30 and 60 degrees. It is here on Thingiverse for want of another repository: Thingiverse - Mitre box
Thanks also Bert for the heads-up on my blog smiling smiley I am a blog noob and learning fast.


_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 19, 2012 11:18PM
Good progress today, the extrusion arrived thanks Bert, and I got the four lower vertices sorted out and printing.
I might lower the printer a bit when I work out the z-axis motor mounts but there is plenty of height for the motors and I could even fit some larger steppers in if I wanted to ...



_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 20, 2012 12:55AM
+1 for NZ Post. To be honest I did not expect it to arrive till after the long weekend,, eye popping smiley

Love your little printer Cam. Busy,busy,busy!!! I am still amazed by the printing process and
will just sit there watching the printer do its thing.(Over and Over... )

Keep up the good work.




Wired1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Good progress today, the extrusion arrived thanks
> Bert, and I got the four lower vertices sorted out
> and printing.
> I might lower the printer a bit when I work out
> the z-axis motor mounts but there is plenty of
> height for the motors and I could even fit some
> larger steppers in if I wanted to ...
> [i825.photobucket.com]
> 1/Reprap%203D%20printer/C-1.jpg


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 21, 2012 02:04AM
Yes it's fun to watch when there's nothing else to watch. I originally set up the webcam so I could check the printer progress without having to leave the warm lounge room smiling smiley



_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 23, 2012 12:08AM
Nice red printed parts. Did you get the filament from Vik at Dimondage?

I bought some a while back and it was really good stuff.

Any case good luck with the rest of the build.


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 23, 2012 12:17AM
Yes Vik's the guy for filament, normally ships it the same day you order it. Two reels turned up this morning with the courier so I can get back into printing in red again smiling smiley


_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 24, 2012 05:08PM
Aaaand I'm back!

The last week has been spent whipping myself up a website to host my build process and researching/purchasing the remaineder of my parts. .
No quite done but nearly there, will launch my site in a few days and chuck a link in my signature.

Just had the quickest delivery time in history... I ordered my electronics at 11pm Sunday night and they arrive Wednesday
morning.... from China!!! Wow

Awesome stuff simon, I am super Impressed with the speed at which you have progressed with this project!
I like your design a lot, we seem to be on the same wave length as far as modifications from the original design
as I am also intending to do Mendelmax inspired extrusion over hangs at the top of the prism to mount the z rods etc.

What lengths are your extrusions?

Bert.. very interested in the Black Extrusions you offered!! However what is the price difference?

Regards,
Jason
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 24, 2012 07:59PM
I've deviated a bit from my original idea now and haven't posted any photos yet. After going to great lengths to spread the top beams and let the carriage pass between them I realised I am not gaining any more height due to the x-axis rods hitting the top of the sides so now I've redesigned the ends to have the cross bars right at the top and still have a huge build height anyway.
My beams are all 330mm and I came up with that figure to minimise the amount of extrusion needed and reduce waste. I will take a big 200x200 build plate so no need to go any bigger.
Should have more photos soon.


_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 26, 2012 07:43PM
All righty my website is live...
Feel free to check it out..
Still very much under construction though as I'm attempting to catalogue the last 6 or so years of my projects.

[origininventive.com]
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 27, 2012 01:58AM
You've been busy Jason.
My no.1 printer has a bit of a melt-down this week and started turning out horrible prints, ended up fitting a new hot end as I had somehow managed to completely clog up the previous one. I should be able to clear it eventually but I had a spare hot end and little patience right now.

So this week I have been re-thinking the frame components and added a couple more rails front and back to better spread the motor and idler load for the y-axis carriage. I also abandoned the idea of having wide top bars to let the x-carriage pass between them as it turns out there is bugger all difference in height either way.

This printer will still print close to 150mm high and for a small printer that is plenty in my book.
More detail and photos on my blog and the printer webcam is running flat out at the moment printing new parts.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/27/2012 01:59AM by Wired1.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 27, 2012 09:40PM
Bit more progress today...


Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/27/2012 09:41PM by Wired1.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 12:22AM
Hi Jason...

Sorry for the late reply. The black extrusions are $2 more expensive per meter.

( Still don't have a proper PC going and thanks JB Hifi for for canceling my order
and only telling me a week later after I had to contact them first... I can only shake my
head in disbelieve!!! )

Inventive Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Aaaand I'm back!
>
> The last week has been spent whipping myself up a
> website to host my build process and
> researching/purchasing the remaineder of my parts.
> .
> No quite done but nearly there, will launch my
> site in a few days and chuck a link in my
> signature.
>
> Just had the quickest delivery time in history...
> I ordered my electronics at 11pm Sunday night and
> they arrive Wednesday
> morning.... from China!!! Wow
>
> Awesome stuff simon, I am super Impressed with the
> speed at which you have progressed with this
> project!
> I like your design a lot, we seem to be on the
> same wave length as far as modifications from the
> original design
> as I am also intending to do Mendelmax inspired
> extrusion over hangs at the top of the prism to
> mount the z rods etc.
>
> What lengths are your extrusions?
>
> Bert.. very interested in the Black Extrusions you
> offered!! However what is the price difference?
>
> Regards,
> Jason


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 12:33AM
Simon(wired1), looks like you are making some really good progress...

Looking at the Ulitmakers, is the motor-less head not a better idea?
Much lighter and faster. Less control I would think,but from what I can
see it does not look like the quality is suffering.

Jason(Inventive) also had an interesting idea. Would it possible to just
Scale the original Mendel-Max parts down to 75% to fir Openbeam?


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 01:10AM
Yeah I haven't gotten into bowden tube extruders yet but it must be coming - I'm keen to experiment with multiple heads soon and that is difficult with them all on the carriage. For this build I am using stock x-ends and carriage/extruder that I know work. I also want to have a crack at better x-ends than are currently available but that can wait too.
I don't know how you would scale the mendel max parts but it should work in theory and it would get you up and running pretty quick. Some parts would have to be altered like the z-axis motors, in fact all the motors as they are still the same size. Not my kind of project anyway, I'll leave that to someone else.
I will be having black extrusions next one now that I know you have them - look way cool with yellow or one of those fluoro-coloured filaments smiling smiley


_________________________________________________________________________________________

Richmond, New Zealand
Thingiverse ~ YouTube
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 01:58AM
My exact thought on the black extrusions to... It will make the other colours pop.

I did not mention them before because they are still in the air but should arrive
later next week. I have some samples of them and the do look nice.

I was thinking that a multi-coloured head would be much easier with the bowden
tube extruders.



Wired1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yeah I haven't gotten into bowden tube extruders
> yet but it must be coming - I'm keen to experiment
> with multiple heads soon and that is difficult
> with them all on the carriage. For this build I am
> using stock x-ends and carriage/extruder that I
> know work. I also want to have a crack at better
> x-ends than are currently available but that can
> wait too.
> I don't know how you would scale the mendel max
> parts but it should work in theory and it would
> get you up and running pretty quick. Some parts
> would have to be altered like the z-axis motors,
> in fact all the motors as they are still the same
> size. Not my kind of project anyway, I'll leave
> that to someone else.
> I will be having black extrusions next one now
> that I know you have them - look way cool with
> yellow or one of those fluoro-coloured filaments
> smiling smiley


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Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 04:40AM
Awesome progress Simon! Seems to be coming together very nicely.

I will definitely be going for the black extrusions Bert as I very much like
designs which manage to achieve a balance between visual aesthetics and functionality.
Lime green is currently winning.

I have also been tossing up the idea of experimenting with potentially using OpenBeam as X,Y or Z slide
rails. Which is already a semi proven concept based on Johanns OpenBeam rostock build.

Totally agree regarding Bowden style extruders.. I am intending to use Air Trippers Bowden extruder
design (used in rostock) with dual extrusion at the top of my desired tweaks once I get it up and running that is.

Hope you guys like my website.. I'm excited to get rolling with my build. Will be posting a near daily
bases from here on out.


[origininventive.com]
The inventive endeavors of Jason
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 07:10PM
Hi There,
Just curious how these bolts work, and what they look like if you have a picture of them. Just trying to figure out how the bracket is secured into the channel with these, I presume you do not drill through the aluminum .
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 07:22PM
If you know how standard t-slot extrusion works (with t-nuts), it's exactly the same but openbeam uses standard cheap M3 nuts instead. You slide the nuts in to opening at the and of the extrusion And then us short screws. However in some cases it is appropriate to screw directly into the extrusion.


[origininventive.com]
The inventive endeavors of Jason
Re: MendelMax / Rostock Experement Using OpenBeam
October 28, 2012 10:30PM
Hi there,

No drilling... I have taken a nice closeup to make it a bit easier to see.

Regards,
Bert


space1999 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi There,
> Just curious how these bolts work, and what they
> look like if you have a picture of them. Just
> trying to figure out how the bracket is secured
> into the channel with these, I presume you do not
> drill through the aluminum .


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