Stick too well, what to do?

Today i just tried printing pla on the famous blue tape. the tape is on a glass and i run the printer without heating the bed. the print just stick well, even too well that hard to remove. especially the big part. there are two big parts left i just could not remove by hand. I dont want to use force first before asking. once in youtube saw ppl spray something before remove any part and then getting easier. anyone knows what liquid to use or any other non force method to remove the parts from bed?

thanks.

Hello Zungmann...

Hate to tell you... your going down the wrong road.

From several of my previous post:

When I first got my printer a little over a year ago, I spent maybe 100 hours to get everything dialed in (calibration, suitable profiles for my slicing programs and getting PLA to stick to my heated glass print bed).

This is what I have learned :

NOT all PLA Filaments are created equal (so keep a log and you might have to create variations in your slicing profiles; Filament Diameter, Temperature, Flow Rate, Filament Density Ratio etc.).

________

Heated Glass Print Bed Setup:

To get any type of filament to stick to your print bed, the bed has to level within about 1/4 of your Layer Height (Layer Height say is .2mm, your bed should be level within say .05mm).

Bed Temp is critical, for PLA set to 55c-60c. Under 55c your PLA will not stick, and over 60c the first layer may actual blister which makes for a very ugly First Layer and increases your risk of the print lifting later during printing.

Z Home height of course is critical.
________

Extruder Temps:

Higher Extruder Temperatures do not help, they create the opposite affect: Warping which leads to detachment from the printing surface.

The higher extrude temperature on the first layer, is in fact wrong. The more heat, the more cooling occurs in regards to heated bed temp and ambient room temperature, hence MORE warping and curling of your print.

I generally print my first layer at normal extruder temperature to 3c-lower than my general extruder temperature.

________

Rafts & Brim Features:

Forget Rafts (you don't need them), but you do need a good First Layer (slow down the Feed Rate and adjust the Flow Rates and use a Skirt/Brim Feature (Slicer has this feature and so does Skeinforge v50 with Brim Plugin; adjust setting so that Skirt/Brim is part of/touches the outside Perimeter of your First Layer), this feature will prevent your print from curling the edges or worse separating when your print has progressed and almost finished.
________

Backyard Methods for getting print to stick to HPB:

IMHO use of Blue Painters Tape is for substandard printers that produce substandard first layer results (blue tape is fine for the hobbyist printing toys, but not for engineering prototyping community).

IMHO, using painters tape and magic potions to try to fix a "solvable problem" (that is solvable with a non-mickey-mouse/ridiculous method)", reminds of the "ol' backyard mechanics methods used by the uniformed/inexperienced/or the just plain & stupid".

Don't waste your time or chase your tail around with bad useless information and mickey-mouse backyard mechanics methods trying to get your printer to perform properly (as a newbie a couple of years ago, I did this for weeks).
________

PLA Parts Stick to Heated Glass Printer Bed 100% of the time and easy to remove when cool:

I experimented with Acetone, Isopropyl Rubbing Alcohol etc. I found that my prints stick and adhere perfectly every time by using this method.

Use Rubbing Alcohol moistening a clean paper towel, wipe bed, and then immediately gently blow the glass print bed dry (if you do not blow it dry, it seems to leave a slight residue that prevent the PLA from sticking to the bed). This method WORKS 100% of the time !
________

Professional Results:

I like precision, dimensional accurate, and of course nice looking parts that using Blue Painters Tape is unable to yield for the printed first layer.

Do you see any Professional 3D Printers ever sold with a optional roll of blue tape and a bottle of magic sticky potion ? I think NOT.

Hope this helps !

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/2013 01:01PM by ShawnT98027.

Quote
ShawnT98027
Do you see any Professional 3D Printers ever sold with a optional roll of blue tape and a bottle of magic sticky potion ? I think NOT.

Again Shawn NO professional machines have a heated bed. They all use some sort of surface that you label as MAGIC for printing. Some use disposable foam board, some use disposable acrylic, some use coatings consisting PVA and other magic ingredients and most use Rafts.

I am not here to fight I just wanted to get the FACTS straight and prevent misinformation from being spread. I will not be responding any further on this matter so please stay professional.

---

FFF Settings Calculator	Gcode post processors	Geometric Object Deposition Tool Blog
Tantillus.org	Mini Printable Lathe	How NOT to install a Pololu driver

@shawn Im sorry that you behave like this. zungmann asks a very simple question and you come with a whole agenda of what is the best way to print, pissing everybodys elses ways as substandard, non/professional, backyard and a bunch of other terms.

Im sorry to break it to you but reprap is a non proffessional backyard hobby, and people use all kinds of ways to make prints stick to bed. I for example dont use tape, but use lemon juice with a heatbed. That doesnt mean that all the others who use masking tape or any other method are wrong? If it works for them its jolly good.

Yes your minimal error level printing bed maybe YOUR secret, but me for example Im not so anal retentive about it and I prefer a thicker first layer. Do I get sub-standatd prints? hell no. Is your way the only RIGHT way? hell no

Zungmann's masking tape works exceptionally well according to his experience. So well that the prints stick TOO much. And that was his simple question.

In which question there are some simple answers.

So zugmann, congratulations! You succed in making the PLA stick, getting it to unstick is a piece of cake

1st you can wait for the print bed to cool down first.

2nd (if you dont want to wait or waste energy heating up and cooling the bed) I usually hit the part with the back of a screwdriver a couple of times. The shock tends to make the part unstick with no deformities , and thats especially true for bigger parts

3rd use a very thin bladed knife (like a box cutter) to make the part unstick. this method can cause some deformity some times.

you can also combine methods

happy printing

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/2013 06:51PM by waste.

Thank you all for your inputs. Shawn is too generous with the feedback
Anyway it is true that ppl get difference experiences, some hold true for me but not for others. Before this I have been printing with glass on top of hbp with 55-60 degC and been great, some pla tend to stick less and curl up, and setting the temp and speed just overcome the problem.

@Waste, you right i want to reduce energy used for printing bcause dont have abundance at home. and electricty shutdown during printing is a pain. So after sometime searching ... found this blue tape and proven to be good or too good, hence asking how ppl usually do before i break the bed , experiences always welcomed

what worked for me is to adjust first layer height an/or extrusion width(slicer has option for first layer extrusion width). just the opposite of when it doesnt stick good enough. it is a balance a part without much contact with bed you may want to stick better lower first layer height a lots of contact raise first layer height. for parts stuck to good i used a razor to start edges then a putty knife sometimes when i was learning i had to beat the hell out of them but they eventually pop off without any/much damage.

Acrylic Bed with Kapton Tape sticks the PLA well also easy to remove anybody tried that ? But don't work well for bigger prints with thinner walls

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/10/2013 10:17AM by GowthamJGR.

---

Enjoy life

I would like to try an epoxy/bakelite/tufnol/garolite/whatever plate …

Any experience so far?

Hi,

I have the same problem. As soon as my models get a bit bigger (that is above 1cm/halve an inch, some 10cm² in area) they stick fantastically well on the kapton tape. I print with a more-or-less default config on an Ormerod: Bed @65C (later 60C), Hotend 205C (later 185C).

Even cooling doesn't help. I even put the glas+model into the fridge without much success (and using force only destroyed the model, but it still sticks)

can you help?

Hiya TruBlu, I have the same machine as you, but then maybe you know....
Ok I stopped using Kapton tape months ago. I print directly on the glass.... Nothing special.... It's easy..
Get rid of your tape. Use washing up liquid, neat, and using your fingers scrubb it into the glass to get rid of any oil/grease.
Rinse with HOT water.... Use CLEAN Kitchen paper towel to dry the glass.... If you see a rainbow in the glass then wash it again....
It must be very very clean.... Ok, mount the glass. I perfer to have my bed level and turn compensation off, but it's up to you.
I like to check and re-check the the Z axis is zeroed ok. I use 55' for the bed and 195' for the HotEnd.
When I use Slic3r I always add a BRIM. Tall stuff I use 10mm minimum..... If your plastic won't stick then check the Z axis height is ok.
The first layer, print slow...50%, then you can speed up on the other layers. When the print is finished, take the glass and print to the kitchen and run COLD water over the print.
Normaly the print will float off....
Message me if you get stuck..... Sometime after washing & mounting the print might refuse to stick... Use Vinegar on a hot bed.... that normaly fixes it.
On our machines I have also found that the nozzle mount can cause our prints not to stick. It seems sometimes the nozzle is not level with the glass. Use my link to print a new one.....
If you want an extra 1mm clearance on the probe use the mount with curved edges.....
All the Best,
Kim...

---

Please send me a PM if you have suggestions, or problems with Big Blue 360.
I won't see comments in threads, as I move around to much.
Working Link to Big Blue 360 Complete

Hi,

Do you clean it this way after each print? Seems quite an afford.

I just tried it, but seem to have difficulties in finding the right z height. The nozzle nearly hits the glass and it mostly works, but sometimes it does not stick completly and I get a small blob of plastic.