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Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?

Posted by Red_Tide 
Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 17, 2009 08:36AM
Perhaps not realistic given the early stage of the project, but maybe reprap could have an extruder head do this sort of stuff a decade from now. Might be worth exploring the possibility of creating crosslinks between the reprap and the medical research community. I can imagine a day when field hospitals might be set up in distressed areas with a need for tissue printing. I suspect a cheap, modular, self replicating, open source design might be just what the doctor ordered. See link below for cheezy youtube video on bio or organ printing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80DhBLEhdzk&feature=player_embedded
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 18, 2009 08:19AM
Nope, haven't been thinking about that. My fridge isn't big enough. smiling bouncing smiley


-------------------------------------------------------

Hell, there are no rules here - we're trying to accomplish something.

Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.

Thomas A. Edison
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 18, 2009 10:50AM
Can you imagine the junk mail associated with this capablity to do garage enhancements?
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 18, 2009 12:42PM
As someone who has designed and built cell/tissue/DNA printers, I can tell you that the difference between the bioprinters and reprap is basically the print head and the material being "printed". So in theory a reprap could one day do it.

I would try to keep the name reprap out of that field of research if you can because the next thing you know people will be screaming that reprap is being used to kill babies. For some reason the crazy protesters seem to think that anything related to biological research these days involves stem cells.
Actually, this was the first thing I thought of when I found out about reprap.

Eventually I'm going to want new organs. winking smiley
VDX
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 19, 2009 09:22AM
... i remember some talks about this last year - but AFAIK until now nobody has received reprapped organs or such spinning smiley sticking its tongue out

Viktor
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 21, 2009 08:37AM
I guess we better add a reprap MRI project to the table so that you can the 3d pattern for your replacement organs then.
I, myself, am designing a Frankenstein monter in STL files.
VDX
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 22, 2009 12:20AM
... there are some experiments with ink-jet printing live tissues - extreme complex, as you can't simply print the shape of the organ and "have it running" eye rolling smiley

You have to embed some specialized functions too: - supporting blood vessels, glands, aditional stem-cells for automatic reshaping/reparing when activated, and some others too ...

And then you have to connect the organ wihle 'fabbing' to a blood- and oxygene- and some sort of feeding support too.

So it's a much more complex task than "simple print with two or more toolheads" ...

Viktor
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 22, 2009 05:26AM
VDX Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------
>
> So it's a much more complex task than "simple
> print with two or more toolheads" ...
>
So were "simple prints" smiling bouncing smiley


-------------------------------------------------------

Hell, there are no rules here - we're trying to accomplish something.

Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.

Thomas A. Edison
VDX
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 22, 2009 06:06AM
... life could be so simple spinning smiley sticking its tongue out

Viktor
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 22, 2009 07:57AM
[www.youtube.com] spinning smiley sticking its tongue out


-------------------------------------------------------

Hell, there are no rules here - we're trying to accomplish something.

Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.

Thomas A. Edison
VDX
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 22, 2009 12:14PM
Hi Forrest,

... i know this clip and some earlier too ... it's not only the price what renders common "organ-printing on demand" useless.

This is not real shape-printing, but more flood specific areas with supporting fluids embedding some floating cells and hope they will settle in the right positions and start growing and spreading.

Some ten years ago i had some crosstalks with scientists from IMM in Mainz how it's best to settle living cells in grids, arrays and slices for medical investigation - there we had some very specific problems and solutions for this and every type of stem-cells have their own behaviour and treatment for correct behaviour eye rolling smiley

In our body the cells aren't simply "sit .here. and work", but there is an extreme complex communication between the cells, their neighbours and the 'central intelligence' in our brainstem - that's involving chemistry, hormons, electricity, fast frequencies and elf and some holographic 'crossfire' with coherent 'bio-photons' from all around in the body too ...

Actually the scientists can only make some very basic and simple tissues ... when 'building' a new organ like a liver or such, they only can probe a piece of the original organ, try to breed the cells until they form a bigger bulk and place them in the place where they should work - and hope that it works eye rolling smiley

Far away from "... you lost your kidneys? - No problem, wait an hour and here you have some new ones!"

Viktor
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 22, 2009 10:08PM
A slightly more in depth article talking about printing the scaffolds for organs and more generally about some recent successes in regenerative medicine.

http://www.worldhealth.net/news/growing_body_parts_in_the_lab_becomes_re/
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 22, 2009 10:55PM
They're already probing ways to program stem cells to create replacement tissue.

I think that the guy doing bio printing will use stem cells which would be programmed to be any organ (other than the brain), or any bone. And becuase the stem cells come from the same person needing a new "part", there is no chance of rejection or rejection drugs
VDX
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 23, 2009 12:24AM
... but again, until now the researchers can print only very simple and nearly homogenous structures as bladders, blood vessels and shapes from bone or cartolage.

Even printing a complete heart isn't doable at the moment - only specific parts as heart valves or muscle-pieces - most successfull samples weren't complete repelacements, but 'only' repairs of damaged valves, vessels, or such.

When fabbing much more complex organs like livers, kidneys or lungs you have to go a long way there eye rolling smiley

Another problem is the consistent 'programming' and 'reprogramming' of stem-cells - when not did correctly, then they tend to turn into cancer after some years with a relative high probability eye popping smiley

Viktor
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 24, 2009 11:37AM
Those of us doing bioprinting at the moment, are mostly using epithelial cells which are cheap and easy to harvest and grow. From those cells we can make replacement skin for burn victims and replacement veins and arteries for bypass surgeries. A growing area of research seems to be in making replacement colons as well.

But something like skin that most people consider to be simple, is not so simple. You have to embed micro blood vessels into the skin in the correct place, and still the area will have no feeling because no one has figured out how to do the nerve cell part yet.

For all of the talk about what stems cells may be able to do and what people have done with them so far, using them is still a ways off. Forgettting the possible moral implications of stem cells, the cost to harvest, process, and modify them doesn't make them a good choice for doing bioprinting research with.

In the future, maybe 50 years, it may be possible; but for now we are still taking baby steps with bioprinting.
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 24, 2009 12:55PM
Apparently there are now more ways to get stem cells than simply from embryos.

aka47


Necessity hopefully becomes the absentee parent of successfully invented children.
VDX
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 24, 2009 01:11PM
... stem-cells aren't the problem - you can get them from all around the adult body. You can even change already specialized cells back into prototypes.

You have to learn to 'speak' with them ... that's the trick you have to learn for real bio-fabbing.

And you have to find the trigger for the telomer-/aging-factor ...

Viktor
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 24, 2009 01:39PM
The interesting thing about stem cells is that they apparently, self differentiate given the right environment.

This is how injecting failing organs with stem cells is considered to be therapeutic. They are influenced by the existing cells such that they self differentiate into the correct cell types for their location. The appropriate genes are tuned on/off and the chemical manufactories make Proteins within the cell. Differentiating the cell into something compatible with it's neighbours.

So stem cells injected into a neighbourhood of liver cells become more liver cells etc etc etc.

It follows then that if you are laying up groups of undifferentiated cells (ie Stem cells) you don't actually need to talk to all of them. Just enough to kick start the process. So long as you have critical mass you should get something like what you want. They are all after all working from the same internally documented design for a full organism.

If you were to lay up a group with nothing to steer the differentiation, I think we fully agree, there is no way you could work out what you would end up with. Bit of a heart, maybe a finger could even be a hair follicle or two. It should be some part/s or other of the full organism that is described in their common DNA.

As to printing whole organs as opposed to sheets of tissue this could be difficult. Necrosis will beat you to it on every occasion unless you have the necessary transport system in place to get oxygen, chemical feed-stocks and all the rest to the cells that are buried in the mass of other cells.

I guess this could be why the trend towards scaffolding up organ sections.

cheers

aka47





cheers

aka47


Necessity hopefully becomes the absentee parent of successfully invented children.
VDX
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 24, 2009 02:10PM
... this is why i mentioned you have to learn 'speaking' with them - ist's not only some specialized cells als neighbours to activate/harmonize them ... it's much more: chemistry, nervous signals, hormones, the ominous 'bio-photons' and maybe something yet unknown, what's informing them what to do at the actual position to be harmonic.

It's the same with cancer - some experiments shows that cancer-cells are normal cells, which are excluded from the normal 'communication' ... or to the contrary - if you manage to restore the normal 'communication', you convert cancer- in normal cells again.

This should be one of the most interesting and complicated task of the next decades - i think, if we manage the 'communication' between cells, we can make much more than with 'simple' genetic engineering - imagine 'reprogramming' the stem-cell of a walnut to form a hinged wooden box instead ... or replace a lost finger simply by 'talking' to a cell in the right position.

Or imagine much more sophisticated tasks: - let a complete house with interiour grow out of a nut ... or a 'live' reprap capable of selfrepair and such spinning smiley sticking its tongue out
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 25, 2009 01:05AM
In terms of the initial seed pattern.

It may be sufficient to lay down some cells and then put a piece of the original organ into the middle of them.

N.B. the differentiated and undifferentiated cells must all be of the same line. i.e. have the same genetic patterning both at cell and mitochondrial levels.

As we have observed all good cells have two important characteristics.

1. Each contains the complete description for their organism.

2. Each can communicate directly and indirectly with its neighbours.

Stem or undifferentiated cells are influenced by their direct communications with their neighbours (normaly chemical) and by their indirect communication with their neighbours (Also though to be chemical). To differentiation ie become more suited to a given task.

As you suggested viktor cancer is a thing of two parts, one the cells may or may not loose communication and the second they divide or replicate in an uncontrolled manner. Which one is causal and which one if not both are symptomatic, I have no idea. Cancer does like a lot of lumped disorders appear to be several quite different patterns of dysfunction collected under one heading.

As for self replicating dwellings, machinery et all this is eminently doable when we have the right level of capability and technology. Which as you quite rightly point out we have'nt. Yet.

Just for fun what more do you guys think we need in terms of technological development to achieve directed bio development...... ??

aka47


Necessity hopefully becomes the absentee parent of successfully invented children.
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 25, 2009 12:17PM
"Just for fun what more do you guys think we need in terms of technological development to achieve directed bio development...... ?? "

Better designed "print heads" that could handle single cell placement
without killing the cell from pressure or heat, heads that don't
clog up, and amazingly fast nanopositioning would all be nice.
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 28, 2009 12:39AM
freds Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Can you imagine the junk mail associated with this
> capablity to do garage enhancements?


I can, and it's very scary !eye popping smiley
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 28, 2009 08:07AM
What is ??

The Garage Enhancements

or

The Junk Mail

????

<|winking smiley


Necessity hopefully becomes the absentee parent of successfully invented children.
Hi!
I have worked on biodegadeable, extruded composite materials during my thesis and have co-develeopped a technique to prepare tissue engineering material. We have used Starch,PLA,PHB,PCL as substrate material.
One of our approaches was electrospinning of nanofibres and one was co-extrusion of two inmiscible polymers where one was soluble in a kind of solvent and one was not. After extraction of the soluble polymer, a very fine network of biodegradeable compund was left over. Preferably the solvent had to be as non-toxic as possible in order to have cells grow on it, The solvent of choice would be water in this case. The best water-soluble polymer turned out to be PVA and was also quite inmiscible with the given biopolymers.
The problem is, that the network of biopolymer inside the 2nd polymers matrix does only form by mechanical stress in liquid phase, i.e. by pulling the thread faster than the nozzle output.
If this technique could be trnansferred to the mendel, it would be a fascinating approach.
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
September 12, 2010 12:51AM
Interesting.

Rater than printing up organs what about protein. IE Meat on demand. Foodstuffs.

This is probably doable as would be simpler. Could maybe be done as sheets of meet then reprocessed into mince etc. Or slices to go.

Meat is after all just a simpler organ.

Being stem cells derived from an animal source (yeah I will probably get flamed by AR crazies) it takes away the People issues. And perhaps arguably will result in a better life for animals as they will no longer be farmed intensively for food stuffs. (Maybe won't get flamed by AR crazies)

Given Craign Venters work on Synthetic Organisms (Synthia) a non animal source with a considerably simplified genome is probably doable some time soon.

Re long distance space travel. Having a way to "Make" food would be very useful. Keeping livels tock is very wasteful of resources.


Necessity hopefully becomes the absentee parent of successfully invented children.
Would it be possible to somehow combine Reprap with this: [www.ted.com]

These guys are growing mushroom materials to replace plastics.
Would you really want this solved, you wouldn't be able to use the results for 25 years. *scribbles down solution into notebook, tosses into fire* Reprap first... then the crazy stuff.
Re: Anyone thinking about bioprinting with reprap yet?
December 18, 2010 02:31AM
Remember Reprap was crazy stuff less than 4 years ago.

The majority of the populace still think it is crazy stuff.

If no one bothered with crazy stuff there would be no Reprap.

Something worth considering.

You of course are welcome to ignore it and move on.

"This is not the crazy stuff you are looking for" (said in Obi Wan style)


Necessity hopefully becomes the absentee parent of successfully invented children.
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