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DemonDeltaMicro printer

Posted by DjDemonD 
DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 03, 2016 08:02AM
Okay so I designed a micro delta. Probably the simplest frame design of any delta so far only 5 components!

[www.thingiverse.com]

Only just literally got it running this afternoon, so much work needed I am sure to get it printing well, so if you decide to build one its really alpha stage at this point, but please let me know how you get on and feedback here so it can be developed. But it does print. Full BOM and assembly guide on thingiverse.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/03/2016 08:15AM by DjDemonD.

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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 03, 2016 10:34AM
nice work


Check my rubbish blog for my prusa i3

up and running
[3dimetech.blogspot.co.uk]
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 03, 2016 10:42AM
Thanks, it's not that innovative but I wanted to see if I could design a printer that would work. Seems to.

Now to think up something actually new... If only it were that easy.


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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 04, 2016 02:41AM
I have printed two sets of Kossel XL corners from PETG and both printers seem to loose their stability over time ( matter of weeks ). Especially the screws for stepper mounting seem to get loose soon, but also the aluminum extrusions have to be checked every now and then.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 04, 2016 02:58AM
Thanks its definitely a consideration. I'll keep an eye on it, the petg sections are quite substantial for the forces on them, compared to frame corners so I'm optimistic. These could be abs but then it would need a chamber to print them and I would have to redesign the mating between the linear guides and horizontals as they are currently interference fit and just tapped together.

I've got some petg corexy carriages with a good amount of printing hours on them, no issues so far whereas their abs predecessors cracked eventually.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2016 02:59AM by DjDemonD.

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[www.thingiverse.com] DemonDeltaMicro - Micro Delta Printer & Things I've made/remixed.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 04, 2016 04:16AM
Nice! I am also working on a mini delta that uses the linear-rails-as-frame idea. But it's still in early stages smiling smiley

Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 04, 2016 04:49AM
That looks good, I was deliberately going for rough and ready construction as I had half an idea it might make a good kit as a educational project, very easy frame assembly. Doesn't seem to affect print quality so far. The bed needs clamping differently at abs temps the brackets are softening in petg. I will make abs bed clamps.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2016 06:14AM by DjDemonD.

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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 04, 2016 12:00PM


Well it can print, this was ABS at 0.3mm layer height, the mini hot end lays down filament nicely, its quite a sharp nozzle. This is about the 5th object I've printed. Started off with PLA but I don't really get on with it so now onto ABS.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2016 12:06PM by DjDemonD.

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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
December 04, 2016 02:58PM




ABS 0.2layers, no print fan at all.
Pretty pleased with this, it looks more overextruded in the photos than it is. I'd say the idea that small printers are easier to get good results from is not in any doubt for me. It took weeks of tuning to get my large printer to turn out a benchy like this.


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[www.thingiverse.com] DemonDeltaMicro - Micro Delta Printer & Things I've made/remixed.

Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 05, 2017 09:15AM
Recently changed some things and have updated thingiverse.
-changed to Rich Cattells marlin which allows much more detailed calibration parameters to be used and now have perfect calibration, previously it was close but not quite right.Even the latest Marlin doesn't support this level of adjustment for deltas.
-changed the wiring arrangement using the xbox power supply to improve available power when everything is on.



Just printed this trio of Marvins, ABS, 0.2mm layers, barely any fan at all. The mini hotend is very good at fine details and overhangs. Now if only they could hurry up with the new nozzles they're promising, a 0.3 or 0.2mm nozzle might be able to print some very small things.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2017 09:29AM by DjDemonD.

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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 05, 2017 05:20PM
Dem's some nice marvins DJ!

But come on, don't hold back, 0.2mm layer height is cheating. Print a normal sized Marvin at 0.1mm layer height and take a close up of the top of his eyes / eyebrows. I always struggle with that one bit of filament that droops down right inside his eye socket, when printing at 0.1mm.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 12:22AM
Yeah I get that little bit of filament in the eye socket too. Decided to go for it on this mini printer and try one of the 50% scale Marvin's at 60 micron layers plus a tower. Got halfway through and then it started to massively underextrude, heat creep, so I cancelled and purged the hot end and got away without it blocking. Will try a 100 micron one this evening.


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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 12:58AM
It's amazing how many parts of the printer get tested by this model. On the surface it looks easy. Getting it spot on perfect everywhere, however, is quite a challenge.

Quote
DjDemonD
Will try a 100 micron one this evening.

Much appreciated. Looking forward to it smileys with beer
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 01:37AM
Quote

Just printed this trio of Marvins, ABS, 0.2mm layers, barely any fan at all.

To bad, Rich Cattells FW never made it mainstream. Stupid pi$$ing contests I've often seen in Open Source projects.

What do you mean with barely no fan? I'm ABS newbie and always thought, you must not cool the print. Or do you refer to hotend cooling?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2017 01:37AM by o_lampe.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 02:30AM
No the hot end has a very loud fan on it constantly (although I do use an xbox PSU so I do a M109 R40 then M81 at the end of a print so that it turns off).

ABS benefits from cooling at a very low level say 15-20% of the output of 2x30mm fans, on this printer I use a 60mm fan from the side as the effector is far too small for a fan mounted on it, and barely run it, I set fan max to 25% in slic3r, at 100% the 60mm fan cools the hotend down faster than it can heat itself.

But for bridges and overhangs etc... I'd blast them with as much air as possible.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2017 02:38AM by DjDemonD.

[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe.
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[www.thingiverse.com] DemonDeltaMicro - Micro Delta Printer & Things I've made/remixed.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 02:50AM
Quote
o_lampe
Quote

Just printed this trio of Marvins, ABS, 0.2mm layers, barely any fan at all.

To bad, Rich Cattells FW never made it mainstream. Stupid pi$$ing contests I've often seen in Open Source projects.

What do you mean with barely no fan? I'm ABS newbie and always thought, you must not cool the print. Or do you refer to hotend cooling?

Yes but nothing to stop someone forking it and developing it, I'd be tempted if A) I had the time, B ) I could code worth a damn. But to be fair unless you want your firmware to support some really recent things I can't see any reason not to use it on a arduino 8bit based delta, it prints wonderfully, can do autocalibration if you can be bothered, but since you can define all the parameters you might need to calibrate a delta really well, and manual calibration using least sqaures calc is so easy, I don't see any need to move it forwards right now.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2017 11:48AM by DjDemonD.

[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe.
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[www.thingiverse.com] DemonDeltaMicro - Micro Delta Printer & Things I've made/remixed.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 03:51PM
Quote
nebbian
It's amazing how many parts of the printer get tested by this model. On the surface it looks easy. Getting it spot on perfect everywhere, however, is quite a challenge.

Quote
DjDemonD
Will try a 100 micron one this evening.

Much appreciated. Looking forward to it smileys with beer

Okay so 0.1mm is not my friend.


Curly overhangs on his "gentlemans area" the droopy filament in the eye socket and an eyebrow that looks like he got drunk and his mates decided to play a prank on him.
That being said maybe with a bit more intense and directed cooling which this printer lacks, or maybe try fewer perimeters, what do you think?

I also printed this one on the kossel XL at 60 microns, he's not that great but he is a 50% scale version.



I'm on a mission to show the UM3 that 60 microns is doable. Maybe with the mini hotend on the kossel XL or a 0.2mm nozzle?

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2017 03:55PM by DjDemonD.

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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 04:25PM
Don't feel too bad, 0.1 mm layer height in ABS is hard. You really need some form of directed cooling, aimed right at the nozzle area. I was getting similar results to yours when using a fan blowing across the plate, but when I put some better cooling on, the results improved dramatically.

I realise that it goes against the ethos you have of keeping it super simple, but a layer fan will improve results by a large amount.

I have a spare 30x10 sunon fan that I could send you, along with the STL's for a shroud that snaps into it if you like? I really rate those fans, they are excellent. By the looks of things there might be enough room to mount it onto your hotend somewhere?

Edit: I had a look at your effector/deltaprintr hotend, and think that the fan should be able to be mounted on the opposite side of the heatsink, stood off from the fins by 5-10mm, and everything should work. There appears to be enough room for everything to fit.
The fan is this one: [www.amazon4china.com]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2017 04:34PM by nebbian.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 05:18PM
An easier option might be to just print a duct that directs exhaust air from the hotend cooling fan, back down around and onto the nozzle?
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 06:01PM


0.3mm nozzle, 0.06mm layer height, cheap red ABS, directed cooling.

Still have that F!@#$%^ filament droop inside his right eye. Apart from that (and a bit of crud that fell off the nozzle when printing the keyring loop) this one looks OK to me.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 06, 2017 10:15PM
Wow, 50% scale and 0.06mm layer height is tricky. This is only my second print at 0.06mm (first one is the red one above). Obviously needs work. 50% scale is tiiiiinnnnyyyy.


Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 07, 2017 12:41AM
That red one is stunning well done. The 50% scale one is a challenge at this layer height.When you said ABS at 100 microns is difficult what material would you recommend? If you have no need for that fan, let me know how much you want for it, I'll give it a try, thanks.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe.
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[www.thingiverse.com] DemonDeltaMicro - Micro Delta Printer & Things I've made/remixed.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 07, 2017 04:21AM
I've had the best success with metal filled PLA, the copper gives a beautiful finish, and is very easy to print. Give it a go.

Also, PM sent regarding the fan.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 07, 2017 05:01AM
Yeah I've got some copper fill PLA. Good idea.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe.
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[www.thingiverse.com] DemonDeltaMicro - Micro Delta Printer & Things I've made/remixed.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 07, 2017 05:20AM
Here's a fan duct that should be a good starting point for that hotend, it clips onto the existing mounts for the fan, and should give you 3mm clearance between the part and the duct.


Attachments:
open | download - 30mm fan duct_deltaprintr_mini_0.12.stl (121.9 KB)
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 07, 2017 04:04PM
So good shout on the copper fill PLA. Definitely better at 0.1mm. Barely printed any PLA on this machine so a bit of stringing in places. Eyebrows and eye sockets still a challenge.


But where I'm gaining as its heavy and doesn't curl on overhangs, I am losing at the corners of the eyebrows as the first overhanging layer droops. I reckon I could knock the extruder temp down a bit more. That fan I found on aliexpress $10 plus $8.99 shipping so probably worth getting a couple to save on postage.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe.
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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 07, 2017 07:08PM
That looks pretty good. Strangely my copperfill shows the layer lines a lot more than yours, perhaps mine doesn't have as much actual copper in it as yours does. Some of my other metal filled filaments show similar rough surface texture.
I don't think that it's the weight that helps, it's got more to do with the lack of warping as the plastic cools (PLA vs ABS).

More cooling should help with definition, perhaps try lowering acceleration, and nozzle temperature as well.

My test is that if I can see the facets in the original model then I'm doing pretty well (check the top of the red marvin's head, these are facets from the model). You won't be able to see them with a rough surface finish though.


Definitely get a couple of those fans, they are worth it. They are only 5V, but I've run them at 12V with no issues. No failures yet (unlike just about every other fan I've tried).


That printer of yours is really showing results. I like the way it's going.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2017 07:09PM by nebbian.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 08, 2017 12:20AM
Yeah I found a guy through DH wholesale who will sell me a job lot of those fans pretty cheap, then I can just resell the surplus in the UK.

You are printing in a league I am only aspiring to get promoted to. The only facets I ever see are in low-poly models, or cubes.

This copper fill is very soft for a PLA. A full kg reel is around 2/3 full of filament when it was new, so I suppose that gives an indication of the copper content.

I am really pleased with the tiny printer, what I really want now are some tiny nozzles I really want to set it up to do very small highly detailed models. Still waiting on deltaprintr to bring out some other nozzle sizes. Maybe its time to learn how to make nozzles.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe.
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Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 08, 2017 03:40AM
Have you considered airbrush nozzles? Some people are 3D printing with them. You might be able to fabricobble together an adapter to fit one onto your hotend.
Re: DemonDeltaMicro printer
February 08, 2017 04:04AM
It might be worth a look, Srek is already well into this I think?


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe.
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