Making ABS powder suggestion
Posted by martinprice2004
|
Making ABS powder suggestion March 04, 2010 05:12PM |
Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 376 |
There seems to be some discussion as to the best method of making plastic powder, ie by using a sander etc.
I used to work in an industry and they used to make ceramic powder by using grinding balls in a rotating drum. The raw material would be mixed in a slurry and put in what was effectively a big washing machine with large marbles in it. After a few hours rotating the slurry would be air dried and the powder would be extracted. The grain size could be controlled easily by varying the mill time.
I think this would be a very effective method of reducing the grain size of stock abs pellets to useful powder, after all, this is how sand is made on the beach!
Do a google image search for "ball mill" if you need a better idea of what I am talking about.
Your thoughts please.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2010 05:19PM by martinprice2004.
I used to work in an industry and they used to make ceramic powder by using grinding balls in a rotating drum. The raw material would be mixed in a slurry and put in what was effectively a big washing machine with large marbles in it. After a few hours rotating the slurry would be air dried and the powder would be extracted. The grain size could be controlled easily by varying the mill time.
I think this would be a very effective method of reducing the grain size of stock abs pellets to useful powder, after all, this is how sand is made on the beach!
Do a google image search for "ball mill" if you need a better idea of what I am talking about.
Your thoughts please.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2010 05:19PM by martinprice2004.
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion March 05, 2010 04:25AM |
Admin Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 13,886 |
... caramic-powder or sand is brittle, so you can brake it into even smalle pieces by brutal force 
Plastics are elastic, so below a specific particle size for the material you have more elasticity and skewing than breaking tendency and you can't make them smaller - when applying more force, you'll only apply friction-heating and maybe start fusing the particles again
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
Plastics are elastic, so below a specific particle size for the material you have more elasticity and skewing than breaking tendency and you can't make them smaller - when applying more force, you'll only apply friction-heating and maybe start fusing the particles again
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion March 05, 2010 05:07AM |
Admin Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,791 |
I think that may work. The ceramics must crush well just using weights.
Plastics may need to be cut, unless they've been cooled quite a bit. It may be necessary to use a steel shot with edges:
[www.gesswein.com]⊂=4&subsub=17&catalog=1&CFID=3097894&CFTOKEN=32903889
852-1073 Stainless Steel Shot, Ball Cones (2 lbs.) Ball Cones 2 lbs. Price: $35.25
(There's no photo, but they look like spheres with tiny sharp skirts.)
I know that children's rock tumblers, gun-hobbyist's tumblers, and jewelers's tumblers all do the same thing and may work. A dollop of liquid nitrogen would help shatter the plastic, but that's probably way too esoteric to see RepRap-user cottage industry use.
Although after a comment from Nophead "Milling cutters make dust" I think the easiest might be to just push 3mm filament into a rotary tool/milling machine cutter, and collect the powder. I'll try that first.
Plastics may need to be cut, unless they've been cooled quite a bit. It may be necessary to use a steel shot with edges:
[www.gesswein.com]⊂=4&subsub=17&catalog=1&CFID=3097894&CFTOKEN=32903889
852-1073 Stainless Steel Shot, Ball Cones (2 lbs.) Ball Cones 2 lbs. Price: $35.25
(There's no photo, but they look like spheres with tiny sharp skirts.)
I know that children's rock tumblers, gun-hobbyist's tumblers, and jewelers's tumblers all do the same thing and may work. A dollop of liquid nitrogen would help shatter the plastic, but that's probably way too esoteric to see RepRap-user cottage industry use.
Although after a comment from Nophead "Milling cutters make dust" I think the easiest might be to just push 3mm filament into a rotary tool/milling machine cutter, and collect the powder. I'll try that first.
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion March 05, 2010 07:59AM |
Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 376 |
Viktor
Yes I see your point, plastic is not a hard material and responds differently to ball milling. The water slurry should stop it melting however.
I do know if you examine sand on many beaches in the world a portion of it is plastic dust mixed with sand, so this gives me the thought that it might work.
Heres an article about the environmental problem of plastic in sand.
Nat Geographic
Yes I see your point, plastic is not a hard material and responds differently to ball milling. The water slurry should stop it melting however.
I do know if you examine sand on many beaches in the world a portion of it is plastic dust mixed with sand, so this gives me the thought that it might work.
Heres an article about the environmental problem of plastic in sand.
Nat Geographic
|
Re: defference between ABS POWDER and plastic May 16, 2012 01:40AM |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 16, 2012 05:24AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 22 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 16, 2012 06:28AM |
Admin Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 13,886 |
... should work, as plastics went brittle like glass at this temperatures ... but the ball bearings too
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 16, 2012 06:39AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 22 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion June 07, 2012 02:19AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 22 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion June 18, 2012 03:01PM |
im thinking that if u add water cooling system in to the container and grind abs in to grain style with some "grinder" than try to make powder with ball mill... what will be the result what size will it come in "some time"
making powder with liquid nitrogen hardened abs will cost too much... some one had made plastic powder with some way but how???
3d replicator plastic powder ???
making powder with liquid nitrogen hardened abs will cost too much... some one had made plastic powder with some way but how???
3d replicator plastic powder ???
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion June 18, 2012 03:54PM |
Admin Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 13,886 |
... you can make plastic powder (or more precise plastic microspheres) with plastics (or other materials) that have a very low viscosity when melted.
Simply melt the material to a liquid, then splatter a jet of the fluid on a fast rotating disk - it will 'explode' to myriads of micro-droplets, that flow away and solidify to small spheres ...
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
Simply melt the material to a liquid, then splatter a jet of the fluid on a fast rotating disk - it will 'explode' to myriads of micro-droplets, that flow away and solidify to small spheres ...
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion August 30, 2012 02:48AM |
we can supply Cryogenic crusher,
This cruhser use the liquid nitrogen to freeze the material and make the material crumbly, the lowest temperature can be -196℃. This machine can crush the material which could not be crushed in the normal temperature. It is suitable for food,LDPE,HDDPE,PET,PTFE,Nylon,Polyester,rubber, PC, hot-melt adhesive,ABS, chinese traditional medicine and so on.
Technical parameter:
1.Power:56.25Kw.
2.Principal axis speed:4200r/m,4600r/m,5200r/m.
3.capacity:500~2000KGS/H(according to the material and size).
4.Finished size:80~300mesh.
5.Overall size:3400×1800×3500mm.
6.Weight:1800KGS.
www.chunnant.com
This cruhser use the liquid nitrogen to freeze the material and make the material crumbly, the lowest temperature can be -196℃. This machine can crush the material which could not be crushed in the normal temperature. It is suitable for food,LDPE,HDDPE,PET,PTFE,Nylon,Polyester,rubber, PC, hot-melt adhesive,ABS, chinese traditional medicine and so on.
Technical parameter:
1.Power:56.25Kw.
2.Principal axis speed:4200r/m,4600r/m,5200r/m.
3.capacity:500~2000KGS/H(according to the material and size).
4.Finished size:80~300mesh.
5.Overall size:3400×1800×3500mm.
6.Weight:1800KGS.
www.chunnant.com
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion September 14, 2012 11:46PM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 482 |
Simple idea - why not try a burr mill coffee grinder? Should work well for a few handfulls on ABS. no good for PLA.
Or a similar grinder submersed in mineral oil could both dampen damage to the grinder and prevent heat build up (For small batches. For large batches it would cause greater heat build up without recirculative cooling)
How would you deposit the powder?
0.02
Or a similar grinder submersed in mineral oil could both dampen damage to the grinder and prevent heat build up (For small batches. For large batches it would cause greater heat build up without recirculative cooling)
How would you deposit the powder?
0.02
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion February 06, 2013 08:00AM |
Ideally you could polymerize the ABS directly in the organic phase of a water based emulsion. Basically the particles would be the size of the droplets... This is not accessible to us... If I were doing it, I'd dissolve abs chips with ethyl ether and then mix that with water, using a steel bodied Immersion blender. Heating the mixture would release the solvent, leaving fine abs particles dispersed in water, which you could dry later.
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion February 26, 2013 12:20AM |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion February 26, 2013 12:52AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 482 |
I like the emulsion idea more than grinding...sadly. Grinding plastic is hell. Technicall, you could do it in water to prevent the dangers:
ABS powdered and inhaled is probably very carcinogenic. Its not the chemical, is the size of small particles and the way they distrupt cells entering the lungs. I wouldn't work with that/in that room. Grinding plastics is incredible energy intensive, and also generally inconsistent and wears equipment. The only commercially viable method would be solvent based imo.
ABS powdered and inhaled is probably very carcinogenic. Its not the chemical, is the size of small particles and the way they distrupt cells entering the lungs. I wouldn't work with that/in that room. Grinding plastics is incredible energy intensive, and also generally inconsistent and wears equipment. The only commercially viable method would be solvent based imo.
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion April 28, 2013 05:07AM |
Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 19 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 25, 2013 03:30AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 248 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 27, 2013 02:23PM |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 28, 2013 02:21AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 248 |
hey, we dont manufacture it, we are working with it.
its a basic powder for powder coating, nothing special
here you can see about it, anyone who have powdercoating services could give you some of it to try it...
[www.tiger-coatings.us]
i am not making any adv. just we are working with powder from this company and i dont know any other supplyer...
here are data sheets...
[www.tiger-coatings.us]
as you can see, this is very fine dust...
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/28/2013 02:25AM by woo.
its a basic powder for powder coating, nothing special
here you can see about it, anyone who have powdercoating services could give you some of it to try it...
[www.tiger-coatings.us]
i am not making any adv. just we are working with powder from this company and i dont know any other supplyer...
here are data sheets...
[www.tiger-coatings.us]
as you can see, this is very fine dust...
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/28/2013 02:25AM by woo.
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 28, 2013 04:00PM |
Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 8 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 28, 2013 05:02PM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 248 |
mecanicu Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey this powder coating is use for electrostatic
> painting?
> If that's the case i have a painting shop in the
> yard with me, will ask them for some and test it.
yes!!
you have 2 options, epoxy and polyester, epoxy is for outdoor use, polyester usualy for parts that are indoor....
try with outdoor(uv resistant, stronger etc)
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey this powder coating is use for electrostatic
> painting?
> If that's the case i have a painting shop in the
> yard with me, will ask them for some and test it.
yes!!
you have 2 options, epoxy and polyester, epoxy is for outdoor use, polyester usualy for parts that are indoor....
try with outdoor(uv resistant, stronger etc
)
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 30, 2013 08:47AM |
Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 406 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion May 30, 2013 05:44PM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 482 |
johnrpm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Elecrostatic... laser printer...laser...very fine
> layers....Elecrostatic.
>
> all the elements of a true 3d printer, not just
> layer by layer, but building in 3D.
Just so i can understand this point better, what is meant here? How is this more in 3D or more true to 3D, than layer by layer? Is it faster or accurate in some way?
-------------------------------------------------------
> Elecrostatic... laser printer...laser...very fine
> layers....Elecrostatic.
>
> all the elements of a true 3d printer, not just
> layer by layer, but building in 3D.
Just so i can understand this point better, what is meant here? How is this more in 3D or more true to 3D, than layer by layer? Is it faster or accurate in some way?
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion June 03, 2013 03:56AM |
Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 406 |
A concept I have had in mind for some time,
imagine a post, the charged powder is attracted to it, energy, lasers, electron beam or whatever aranged similar to a tomography
layout fuses the powder, with multple lasers acting in unison on multiple areas of the part.
faster... I do not know
more accurate... maybe
it would be pure research, needing lots of time and effort.
Random Precision
imagine a post, the charged powder is attracted to it, energy, lasers, electron beam or whatever aranged similar to a tomography
layout fuses the powder, with multple lasers acting in unison on multiple areas of the part.
faster... I do not know
more accurate... maybe
it would be pure research, needing lots of time and effort.
Random Precision
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion June 03, 2013 04:11AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 482 |
johnrpm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A concept I have had in mind for some time,
>
> imagine a post, the charged powder is attracted to
> it, energy, lasers, electron beam or whatever
> aranged similar to a tomography
> layout fuses the powder, with multple lasers
> acting in unison on multiple areas of the part.
>
> faster... I do not know
> more accurate... maybe
>
> it would be pure research, needing lots of time
> and effort.
You could even use the diffraction of multiple lasers and the inverse Fourier transform to cure patterns at the nanoscale !
-------------------------------------------------------
> A concept I have had in mind for some time,
>
> imagine a post, the charged powder is attracted to
> it, energy, lasers, electron beam or whatever
> aranged similar to a tomography
> layout fuses the powder, with multple lasers
> acting in unison on multiple areas of the part.
>
> faster... I do not know
> more accurate... maybe
>
> it would be pure research, needing lots of time
> and effort.
You could even use the diffraction of multiple lasers and the inverse Fourier transform to cure patterns at the nanoscale !
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion June 03, 2013 05:50AM |
Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 406 |
diffraction of multiple lasers and the inverse Fourier transform to cure patterns at the nanoscale
Would the particle size of the powder be the limiting factor???,
This concept would not be suitable for all geometries of course, but it may be posible to use resins if something similar
to splutter coating was used, a bit like a mistmaker creating a resin mist that drifts down.
Random Precision
Would the particle size of the powder be the limiting factor???,
This concept would not be suitable for all geometries of course, but it may be posible to use resins if something similar
to splutter coating was used, a bit like a mistmaker creating a resin mist that drifts down.
Random Precision
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion June 03, 2013 06:03AM |
Admin Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 13,886 |
... with powders you'll receive limiting factors roughly around x3 particle diameter ... with resins and "two-photon-recombination" you'll even 'undergo' wavelength limits - the smallest structures with 300-405nm UV are araound 20 nanometers:
[www.nanoscribe.de]
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
[www.nanoscribe.de]
Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]
Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion September 21, 2013 08:51AM |
Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 1 |
|
Re: Making ABS powder suggestion November 17, 2015 09:16AM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 4 |
HI All,
We can offer PMMA (Acrylic ) powder ex stock for SLS in 45, 85 and 140 micron fractions
info@aksechemicals.com for more details
Thanks
We can offer PMMA (Acrylic ) powder ex stock for SLS in 45, 85 and 140 micron fractions
info@aksechemicals.com for more details
Thanks
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.