The Remoter

The remoter is a device to remote drive any turning mechanism within less than 278° by using ubiquitous bowden cables (bike brake cables). I conceived it while analyzing some driving mechanisms for the Simpson delta bot. You simply drive one pulley however you want and the other will follow. Easy to assemble, easy to tense, easy to find replacements. Will let many mechanisms to lost weight. I have in mind a robot arm as its second use (first use is in the Simpson arms).




There are some improvements to be done that I have already been told. Please comment. Nicholas Seward, Annirak, please share your thoughts.


What do you think?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2013 07:36PM by Guizmo.

An interesting concept, that may open up new avenues of machine concepts. Like it.

I would recommend rotating one of the cables 180 degrees. That will reduce the load on your bearing significantly. I have another idea which is a modification of this one; I just need to find since time to sketch it.

There is a company called SPAL that makes power window kits for cars that uses a very similar cable system to transfer power from the motor to the original window crank. If you wan to test the idea for RepRap you may be able to get the replacement cable assembly for cheap enough to make it not worth printing it.

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@ Quazzer, thanks for your response.


@Annirak,

I'll put that in my todo list. Absolutely needed modification. Thanks a lot


@Sublime,

Thanks for the tip. I wonder how that system works. It appears it is a multiturn system, so it can work with the window crank. If that's true, then that's a much better mechanism, making possible UNLIMITED power transmision, not only a restricted amount.

That makes me think, we could design an extruder almost as light as a Bowden extruder, with a remote motor but with no oozing, as the pulling mechanism could be just above the hot end, just like normal extruders! With my design that's not possible!

Thanks!

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2013 01:47PM by Guizmo.

The concept certainly has been used before:




It's the Remoter to the max.

Alexa Robot

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2013 11:16AM by Guizmo.

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Guizmo
@Sublime,

Thanks for the tip. I wonder how that system works. It appears it is a multiturn system, so it can work with the window crank. If that's true, then that's a much better mechanism, making possible UNLIMITED power transmision, not only a restricted amount.

That makes me think, we could design an extruder almost as light as a Bowden extruder, with a remote motor but with no oozing, as the pulling mechanism could be just above the hot end, just like normal extruders! With my design that's not possible!

Sorta an indirect bowden direct drive, that would be cool

Tried to find some info on the SPAL Transmission Assembly. (spal web store)
Was hoping to find documentation on the actual assembly but only found the Product Catalog and the Installation Instructions

Found it on Amazon: Spal 33000030 Deluxe Power Window Kit and just the Universal Window Transmission Assembly

I did find Exploded Assemblies of this Cable Driven Valve where they are using a Helix Cable.

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Guizmo
@Sublime,

Thanks for the tip. I wonder how that system works. It appears it is a multiturn system, so it can work with the window crank. If that's true, then that's a much better mechanism, making possible UNLIMITED power transmision, not only a restricted amount.

That makes me think, we could design an extruder almost as light as a Bowden extruder, with a remote motor but with no oozing, as the pulling mechanism could be just above the hot end, just like normal extruders! With my design that's not possible!

Yes it is multiturn. I used to install them and I believe they may have been some kind of syncro cable like ddseeker linked to or it was a ball chain. The ball chain would be easy enough to test out in a printed version and may be worth a try.

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Wow, thanks guys!

@ddseeker: I also tried to find the patent for the Spal system with no success, but that valve actuador is a great insight.

I'm also thinking about a mechanism that could convert a reciprocating movement to a continuous one, so we could use the remoter in an oscillating way to drive a continuously turning output. One way could be engaging and disengaging automatically a free turning gear to change the direction in a small gear train, using only mechanics... well just a thought.

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Sublime

Yes it is multiturn. I used to install them and I believe they may have been some kind of syncro cable like ddseeker linked to or it was a ball chain. The ball chain would be easy enough to test out in a printed version and may be worth a try.

I was just looking at Vic's Ball Chain Gears the other day thinking, "How can I use this?" and "I need to remember this, encase I figure out a use."

Ball chain is a good idea, but I'd like to use standard bowden cables for how easy they're to find. With the ballchain we would need something like a hoose to keep the tension. It could be tried.

How about something like this Synchromesh Drive Pulley

but just like the ball chain, you need tension...

Speedometer cable? doubt it would have enough torque.

Yes, and that's its main issue. The beauty of the bowden is that the "envelope" provides the neccesary tension and you can route the cable in almost any shape. If we wanted simply to transfer power, then a belt and pulley would be enough.

The speedometer cable is simply a bowden designed to turn along the cable axis. But actually, it could be a good idea for certain aplications.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2013 04:18PM by Guizmo.

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Guizmo
@ddseeker: I also tried to find the patent for the Spal system with no success.

Patent US4767386 - FLEXIBLE-ELEMENT TRANSMISSION. UNIT FOR DRIVING ROTARY MEMBERS IN GENERAL

Patent US5440944 - SAFETY POWER WINDOW MECHANISM FOR ALL TYPES OF AUTOMOBILE FOREIGN

Patent US5615577 - ULTRATHIN TRANSMISSION NIECHANISM FOR ALL TYPES OF AUTOMOBILE POWER WINDOW

Patent US5810687 - POWER WINDOW TRANSMISSION

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2013 05:12PM by ddseeker.

Awesome!

SPAL patent is already 25 years old, so probably is usable. The other ones are close to 20 years too. I wonder how good are those ball chains regarding backlash. If they are as good as antibacklash belts then they're a good solution. We just need to desing the printable parts. I still dream with a bowden cable solution, though. Thanks so much ddseeker!


EDIT: SPAL patent was re-examined in 1999, so it's still enforced. Anyway, it's good to learn and improve existing technology. Let's make it better!

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2013 06:24PM by Guizmo.

In the US patents can't last longer than 20 years. AFAIK.

.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2013 09:56AM by A2.

Thanks guys,

I do know a patent protects the owner from the illicit comercial use of the invention by someone else, but what about opensource? do you believe there will be problems is someone designs a similar product with a free/gratis license? What if someone sells a kit for building it? What if that person is out of the US?

I see a lot of potential in this transmisions.

Patents protect from all use, not just commercial.

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http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent
a patent provides the right to exclude others[17] from making, using, selling, offering for sale, or importing the patented invention for the term of the patent, which is usually 20 years from the filing date[4] subject to the payment of maintenance fees

I think the bike cable setup that you have drawn will be safe enough from patent infringement. I am working on a mock-up that Annirak came up with that should eliminate backlash and the side load.

Let me say this clearly...

ANY DESIGN no matter how original infringes on some patent. It would be an exercise in futility to make something that didn't infringe on something.

As an open source project you are a small target. Patent trolls are motivated by money and most open source projects have none. A secondary factor would be that suing an open source company is bad publicity but I think this wouldn't stop a true patent troll.

So I have this request, if anyone ever comes across a patent that I am infringing upon then I don't want to know. I know they exist.

Well, then I neither want to know,


This is the second design, with some improvements. The suggestion Annirak came up with and the multi-output idea:



Animation is comming

So you going to name this design, Delta Hydra?

Three motors controlling multiple bots.

This is configured for multi-output. A believe that for more than 2 outputs the best bet will be have another bearing giving enough support and avoid the cantilever effect. That would be easy, with the help of God, as the system already has provisions for multiple layers.

As you can see, you can add multiple layers easily. 4 countersunk non threaded holes are provided for the bolts that maintain all together and 4 more M5 holes for attaching the power source (not shown). Same happens with the cable bases. It has 3 countersunk holes for mounting multiple units and 4 threaded holes for mounting the motor base (not shown).

As you can see, the base member is one piece and the multilpe layers are 2 pieces. You could virtually add as much as you want, but the fact is there would be a physical limit.

And no, that is not a RJ45 jack, it's a socket to align and transmit power between pieces.



I believe that bot farms will be cheaper with this device. Calibration would be one issue, but that could be solved by other means.

@ddseeker,

I have no name for a bot using this, just the name of the device itself, but the idea is two in one: the main one, allowing the remote drive of a joint and second one, moving multiple joints in parallel with only one motor.

@ A2

Thanks so much, but I believe I will stay away from patents.

Guizmo, your Remoter reminds me of this thing: Animatronic Tail #1 -courtesy Rick Galinson. Anyone want to stick an extruder on the end of a prehensile animatronic 3D printed tail?

@MattMoses,

Haha, yes, it is a similar device. An extruder in a tail, mhhhh? I have an idea :an elephant holding an extruder with its trunk and making a print could be considered a Reprap? At least they are replicable!

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2013 09:44AM by Guizmo.

What about rotary flex shafts?
That way there is only one cable to the extruder, and not 2 (to/from)

Google: Rotary Flexable Shaft

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a cheep Flexible Drive Shaft for a Dremal could possibly be used for the extruder

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2013 02:29PM by ddseeker.