Motherboard v1.2

Hello!

I would like to build Mendel and I would also like to print the circuit of the v1.2 motherboard by myself.

I think it is a 2 layer circuit, however I don't know if it is a double sided circuit. When I open the .brd files from eagle I see a lot of layers, but I suppose that only the red and the blue ones are the conductor layers (copper layers). I also suppose that this is for printing the circuit in one face, but I don't know if I have to make another at the back.

Another problem is how can I manage to print the circuit in its real dimensions?

Regarding the components,I have some questions:
- which ones can be found in electronic shops?
I guess the ATPMega644P TQFP has to be ordered to atmel.
-Do i need any special SD card socket?

"v1.2 motherboard"? Isn't this the vintage Generation 3 Electronics?

We now have RAMPS, Sanguinololu and Generation 7 Electronics, all with a compareble feature set. Generation 7 Electronics is designed with the do-it-yourselfer in mind: single sided board, only through-hole components.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Electronics parts, including the Atmega can be bought online from electronic distributors like Digikey, Mouser, Farnell, etc. High street electronics shops are unlikely to have all the parts. They are more likely to have the Gen7 parts though.

The layers in the files are all used when professionally manufacturing the board. In addition to the two copper layers there will be a solder mask for each side, a paste mask (if it has surface mount components) and layers for silk screen printing text to show where the components go.

Most home made boards only use the copper layers. You have to print them on a laser printer 1:1 to get them the right size and you would probably have to flip the bottom layer.

As Traumflug says, the board is years out of date and was never designed to be a home manufactured PCB. Some people bought bare PCBs and populated the components themselves but I doubt any made the PCB itself.

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[www.hydraraptor.blogspot.com]

Thank you for your responses!!

I would like to make a Mendel printer that works, but unfortunately I've only found instructions in the wiki page about "how to build Mendel" and there it is used the v1.2 motherboard, so i don't know how to build it with newer electronics.
I'm not able to do a 3D printer without instructions, so I would appreciate advice about other easier ways to do Mendel with home made PCBs: motherboard , opto endstop, extruder controllers, etc.

I will count with the help of the technicians at my university to make the pcbs, so this makes easier my project.

Regarding the size , when I print it in a laser printer (with toner), it seems to me it is very small : 3.9x3.9 inches or 10x10 cm.

Thank you again, your experience is very useful for me!

Regards, David.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2012 12:47PM by Davsp.

The Mendel documentation is old, because that is also an old design.

All the other electronic systems are documented in the wiki and the wiring is all pretty much the same, and simpler than Gen3. You connect the motors to the motor outputs, heaters to the heater outputs and so on.

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[www.hydraraptor.blogspot.com]

I know , but it is very messy to find out where are the links to download the files to see the Gen7 Board 1.3.1 in eagle and gerber and print the circuit. Is this board one sided and 2 layer? so that it can be etched in a copper sheet.
Why components are setted in a sheet that has no circuit? : [reprap.org]

Does this board work better than the v1,2 motherboard? and can be a sustititute for such board?

In gen3 electronics, i can build mendel by building all this:

Motherboard 1.2 | Stepper Motor Driver 2.3 | OptoEndstop 2.1 | Extruder Controller 2.2
optional add-ons: Thermocouple Sensor 1.0 | Magnetic Rotary Encoder 1.0

In gen7 , I only have:

Gen7 Board 1.3.1 | Gen7 Endstop 1.3.1



Regards, David.

You really do not want to build the gen 3 stuff. Almost none of the modern firmware works with the extruder board and the slicing software is starting to drop support for the type of code it uses. No one uses the rotary encoders. And the thermocouple can be used with gen7 if you want, but thermistors are the standard method.

The Gen 7 board will run all the modern firmwares.

Gen 7 will also require 4 pololu A4983 stepper drivers or 4 A4988 stepstick drivers in addition to the parts you mentioned.

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Is there any page where it is explained as clear as in [reprap.org] how to build Mendel but with modern electronics?

By the way I've downloaded :
Traumflug-Generation_7_Electronics-release-1.3.1-32-gd16944f.zip

And I can see : Gen7Board.back.gbr , in violet, this is what i have to print with the laser printer to etch the circuit ?

Thanks,

regards, David.

Electronics and mechanics are pretty much independent of each other. You can build all the mechanics according to the instructions you found already, then build the electronics according to newer instructions and connect them as if you had the older electronics.

BTW., you probably also want to build a Prusa Mendel. The original Mendel design is outdated, too.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Thank you for your altruistic help !!

I've compared the pdf with the board: maybe this are stupid questions, but I wonder,

-Why some lines have different connections, is this because when building the circuit with the milling machine some changes has to be done ?

-To etch the circuit it is enough with the pdf or it is better to dark it in the surrondings as for exampe it is done with the 3rd image?

Regards, David.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2012 08:36AM by Davsp.

The first image is a voronoi pattern used for isolation milling to give a shorter tool path and thicker tracks.

The second image is a conventional pattern for etching. Either way the connectivity should match the schematic. If the connections are different they must be different versions of the design.

The third image looks like it is for isolation milling where the isolated copper areas are left in place to reduce the time and tool wear. Those areas are best removed when etching as unconnected copper is not a good thing.

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[www.hydraraptor.blogspot.com]

Thank you nophead, I will try to etch it with the pattern of the 2nd image that i've checked it has the right dimensions : 100 x 130 mm.
I've found this image : [hannahnapier.co.uk] but maybe with the pdf is enough, because when i try to open .pcb it doesn't work since: "The file you are attempting to load is in a format
which is too new for this version of pcb. To load this fileyou need a version of pcb which is >= 20100606"

Regards, David.

You're obviously using a pretty old version of gEDA. Up until recently gEDA developers had the impression a file shouldn't be openend with any older version. However, it was found unneccessary, so you can open the .pcb file with a text editor and dial the date back, it's in one of the first lines.

Current Ubuntu comes with pcb 20100929.

If you want to save etchant, there's this: [reprap.org]

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Thanks, Traumflug, you are helping me a lot!
I've changed the date & version with the text editor and when i try to open the pcb file it doesn't open because: "illegal fileformat".

I'll try to download a modern version, changing the "intltools" that are too old also ...

Regards, David.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2012 12:55PM by Davsp.

I think I got it
.... after downloading a lot of packages in order to configure it correctly.
Since you have notice , i have to confess that I don't know very much about printing circuits, but I'd like to learn how to do it with gEDA, I'm trying to follow the instructions and i've done this:

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2012 08:02PM by Davsp.

Good work, Davsp! You lost the track for the enable pin and one pin on the Misc header while proceeding. This Misc header isn't important, but the enable pin is If you hit the "o" (optimize rats nest) key on the keyboard, a few yellow lines should appear.

If you print or export to PostScript, you can choose to use black and white instead of colours. That's what you want for the toner-etching process. PostScript can be converted to PDF, if neccessary.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Thank you Traumflug!

Since the circuit of .pcb file is not exactly the same as the one of the pdf, i've decided to do it using the pdf files . However, i'm satisfied because i've learnt about gEDA.

Now, i'll try to etch it!!

Regards, David.

PDF files are those of the last release, .pcb files are more recent.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Hello!

I'm in the process of making the 1.3.1 board, and i have lots of doubts ...

Between polulu and stepstick drivers: am i correct if i think that:
in the stepstick drivers(R=0.2 ohms) with the same Vref ( I_TripMax= Vref/(8*Rs) ) you get less current than polulus' , so that , the boards don't get too hot. Otherwise , it is possible to use the polulu that get hot, what is not good. But I don't know if i've understood correctly, because polulu seem to be more extended and popular.

I've also read in the wiki- Gen7 that 4 motors are needed , i guess they are Nema 17 with 4 wires because those are what are used in all repraps, isn't it?

In other less relevant aspects,I'm finding all the components except the coil and i would like to know if I can use this : [uk.rs-online.com]|alt
and regarding the Double Sided Heat Conductive Tape, i've read that i can substitute it by super glu , am i wrong? .

I'm learning so much with this, i'm very grateful for your help and experience!

Regards, David.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2012 07:18PM by Davsp.

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in the stepstick drivers(R=0.2 ohms) with the same Vref ( I_TripMax= Vref/(8*Rs) ) you get less current than polulus' , so that , the boards don't get too hot. Otherwise , it is possible to use the polulu that get hot, what is not good. But I don't know if i've understood correctly, because polulu seem to be more extended and popular.

Pololus were there earlier and probably it's supplier receives more trust, so they're more common.

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I've also read in the wiki- Gen7 that 4 motors are needed , i guess they are Nema 17 with 4 wires because those are what are used in all repraps, isn't it?

Yes. This is valid for about all RepRap electronics.

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i would like to know if I can use this : [uk.rs-online.com]

Looks good and I'll PM you the price of a known-to work set of parts, all in one bag. Err, two bags.

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regarding the Double Sided Heat Conductive Tape, i've read that i can substitute it by super glu , am i wrong? .

Standard super glue isn't sufficient, but there are more heat resistant ones. For me, I use screw locking glue ("Loctite"), which is rated to some 200°C. Loctite sometimes doesn't harden immediately, but powering up the electronics with motors connected will heat the chips and resolve this problem.

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Hello, folks.

I’ve just finished building a Prusa Mendel (kit from RepRapKitStore). The machine came with a Sanguinololu 1.3a board which (I’m fairly sure) I’ve correctly installed. I’ve loaded Sprinter firmware and am using Pronterface as my main control software. The only changes to Sprinter I have made is to select my electronics and baud rate (Configuration.h) and to modify the thermistor tables (thermistortables.h) to use the thermistors that came with the kit. (Shown below.)

I have good and proper commanded motion from all 5 stepper motors so I know the board is accepting and distributing power and has a comms with my pc. Thus far though I haven’t been able to get any power to the extruder head or hot bed. My assumption is that I am correctly using Pronterface to command that power be supplied. For the extruder for example I use the drop down box to select ‘185 (pla)’ and then click on the ‘Set’ button to initiate heating. Is there something here I’m missing? (By the way does anyone have a Pronterface user’s manual?)

My multi-meter shows zero voltage on all on the output pins for both the extruder and bed and I know I should be getting 12v.

As an aside, both thermistors report a more or less constant temperature of about -25 c and my house is far warmer than that.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for listening.

Thermistor table.
#if (THERMISTORHEATER == 6) || (THERMISTORBED == 6) // 100k Epcos thermistor
#define NUMTEMPS_6 20 // *** note that this is changed to 20
const short temptable_6[NUMTEMPS_6][2] = { // note that the name of the table is changed to replace the existing table
{1, 599},
{54, 160},
{107, 123},
{160, 103},
{213, 90},
{266, 79},
{319, 70},
{372, 62},
{425, 55},
{478, 49},
{531, 43},
{584, 37},
{637, 31},
{690, 25},
{743, 19},
{796, 12},
{849, 5},
{902, -3},
{955, -16},
{1008, -42}
};

Thanks again , Traumflug!

I'm planning to make a small reprap (pro-huxley) with some variations : Since i have no "mother-printer" I've thought to make the pieces with silicone moulds. Another idea that i have in mind is to make a base to support the printer and under it i will add some wheels with servos in order to move the printer without touching it (like a robot-printer). Maybe i'm doing a stupid or impossible variation, in my imagination everything is possible!

By the way I have 2 more questions:

- if i need 5 motors, i need 5 stepstickers, isn't it?

I'm planning to buy this motors, heat bed and stepstickers , could they be suitable for the Gen 7 electronics:

MOTORS:
[www.ebay.com]

HEAT BED:
[www.ebay.com]

STEPSTICKERS:
[www.ebay.com]

Regards, David.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2012 07:44PM by Davsp.

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Davsp
- if i need 5 motors, i need 5 stepstickers, isn't it?

No, only four (4) since the z-axis motors are connected to one controller (series is better but parallel also works).

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Since i have no "mother-printer" I've thought to make the pieces with silicone moulds.

If you want to be done in reasonable time I'd prefer a wooden design, like the WolfStrap. Then you have your "mother-printer" and all the electronics, motor and extruder stuff is reusable.

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