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Precision Piezo bounty

Posted by Moriquendi 
Precision Piezo bounty
September 11, 2017 12:02PM
Want a free Precision Piezo kit?

There are hundreds of different types of printer in use these days, to encourage more people to try out piezo Z-probing technology we need mounts for more of the common printers. Without buying lots of different printers we can’t make mounts for all the popular printers so instead we’re offering a free kit in exchange for designing a mount. We’ve got a short list of printers we’d like to have mounts for but suggestions are welcome.

Prusa I3
Anet A8
Creality 3D - CR10

Here are the rules:
The design must be open source and printable on the printer it’s designed for.
Achieve a repeatability of 0.01mm and a standard deviation of 0.007.

We’d like to see a video of a bed levelling cycle that shows both the probe and the results (probe and screen in shot)
If you don’t already have a kit to use we will send one out to you (free within the UK).
If for whatever reason you can’t get it done either pay for the kit or send it back (we’d like to see results within about a month)

We’ve got 10 kits to send out, if you’re interested drop me a PM

Idris


{Precision Piezo} Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
September 11, 2017 12:32PM
I have a FolgerTech 2020 Prusa i3 that I could develop a mount for if you are interested. I live in the US so that might be a problem, but I do product design for a living so making a mount would be straight forward. Let me know!
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
September 11, 2017 01:50PM
Sounds good to me, ideally we're after something different from the PP20 module, that allows for different hotends/extruders to be used.

If you PM me your address we'll get a kit posted out to you.

Idris


{Precision Piezo} Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
September 11, 2017 08:52PM
I doubt you need one for my printer...will it be as tidy as the one I saw on the BIQU Delta

Re: Precision Piezo bounty
September 12, 2017 04:27AM
Yes but that's a deployable fsr which will not be as accurate or repeatable when used to probe multiple times in one session, look at the repeatbility over multiple sessions and it will be miles off, but compared to an inductive sensor I'd take that.

Also I presume it has a sticky pad on one side? It can't be magnetic, and you'd have to keep taking your silicone sock off.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
September 12, 2017 08:12AM
I'm not sure what it is or how it does its magic, presumed piezo, didnt think it would be a good idea to keep attaching to hotend(@ temp?), just seen it in the sexy cyborg video, thought it was small & neat, and it seemed to do the job, though I thought the one in the video was smaller.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/12/2017 08:12AM by MechaBits.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
September 12, 2017 09:06AM
That's definitely a Force Sensitive Resistor, completely different tech, more delicate and less accurate. You also have to contend with fitting it over any gunk that ends up on the nozzle or heaterblock. Of course I'm biased but I've used FSRs and deployable probes and nothing comes close to the accuracy, ease of use and durability of piezos.

I have a fully integrated piezo delta effector that I use on my kossel mini but I don't think I could sell it at a price where people would buy it. The other problem is that because it includes connectors for the heater cartridge there would be liability issues if anything ever went wrong.



Idris


{Precision Piezo} Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
October 26, 2017 03:34AM
Custom corexy based on this TaoBao model

Custom mount made from 3mm acrylic, lasercut on a cheap 40W CO2 laser, can also be milled on a cnc machine. DXF can be downloaded here.





From bottom up you need:
1)Hotend is held by a sandwich made of: smaller circle piece, U shape, another U shape (rotated 180 degrees), and another smaller circle piece
*Actually the first part, near the heatsink is 4mm plywood, I use a heated bed (110 deg), heated chamber and nozzle at 230 deg so I thought better safe then sorry. Later on my delta I used only acrylic pieces and no problems so far smiling smiley
2)Put the piezo on top
3)The larger circle piece
4)Put 4 M3x 35/40/45mm and 4 nuts. Pretension the piezo a little like in the DjDemonD's youtube guide. Glue the piezo with a litte CA glue on the margin.
The screws are 30mm apart. If you can, use a flat hotend holder with appropriate sized and spaced holes and make the whole assembly easier to fix.
To hold the bowden is the top part cut from another e3d v6 heatsink (the threaded groove part) held in place by another acrylic sandwich, and again topmost layer is plywood, but can be acrylic.

Running M48 on latest marlin I get 3 micron resolution/deviation:
Send: M48
Recv: M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test
Recv: Finished!
Recv: Mean: -0.015469 Min: -0.017 Max: -0.014 Range: 0.003
Recv: Standard Deviation: 0.001298
Recv: 
Recv: X:200.00 Y:200.00 Z:1.00 E:50.00 Count A:32000 B:0 Z:640
Recv: ok

And another photo of my "sandwich" groove hotend holder, this time on my Tevo Little Monster delta printer. Unfortunately smoothieware hasn't got a probe accuracy test built in. I used 626pilot's branch some time ago, but I've lost the config for it so no accuracy testing done on the delta.


Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/26/2017 03:50AM by executivul.
Attachments:
open | download - piezo.dxf (241.9 KB)
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
October 26, 2017 06:27AM
So, I designed a mount for the Tevo Tarantula's stock hotend. You can find it here: [www.thingiverse.com]

Video of the unit working:
[youtu.be]

I also ran a lot of tests yesterday and found out it's pretty damn precise. Pictures attached.




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/26/2017 07:33AM by Heracles421.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
October 31, 2017 08:25PM
Hello! I got a mount working for the D-Bot (but probably can be used on the C/J other bots too)

Results from G31 S-1 (12 times), duet wifi firmware

0.303 0.308 0.310 0.310 0.312 0.315 0.315 0.317 0.317 0.317 0.320 0.317, mean 0.314, deviation from mean 0.005

Threw those numbers on a spreadsheet and got

min	0.303	
max	0.32
range 0.017
stdev	0.004888917585

This is a video: [www.youtube.com]

and this is the thing: [www.thingiverse.com]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2017 08:25PM by coredump.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
November 07, 2017 02:40AM
Thanks to those who have contributed designs. If you have made one but haven't posted it here yet please do so.

We've given out our 10 free kits so from now onwards, if you can design a mount for a machine that we currently do not have one for (or make a substantial improvement on a current design) then we will offer 25% off your next order from us.

Currently, we have mounts for
D-Bot
Tevo Tarantula
Titan/Aero
Various delta effectors
Reach3D
Voron
TaoBao Corexy

We would really like something mounted on:
Cr-10
Original Prusa i3 Mk2
Original Prusa I3 Mk3

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2017 10:09AM by DjDemonD.

[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
November 13, 2017 01:24PM
Hi,

I am interested in trying out this type of Z Probe. Can't say that i can design a proper mount (not sure where the sensor needs to be placed exactly on my machine for it to work) but if anyone is willing to create a mount for the Wanhao I3 (v2.1) that would be cool. Alternatively if someone can explain to me how exactly this type of sensor needs to be mounted in general on a hotend i might take a crack at it to design a mount for it and give it a go.

I am currently trying out different Z probes to see which works best. Currently i use a BL touch clone but i am going to try the original as well along with a capacitive sensor and i also have a Mini IR board on the way. To round it out i will probably also give this type of probe a shot because i really like the concept of the nozzle being the probe with no offset.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
November 13, 2017 01:36PM
See www.precisionpiezo.co.uk under support and resources. This probe will outperform in terms of accuracy, repeatbility and conveninece almost all others except duet smarteffector (which works in a very similar way) it sometimes takes a bit of tuning but all sensitive instruments do.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
December 04, 2017 07:49AM
Here's the Precision Piezo carriage for the VORON CoreXY printer (for anyone who's looking!)
[www.thingiverse.com]
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
December 04, 2017 08:23AM
Brilliant work many thanks I am sure it will be very useful to many. How is it performing?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2017 08:23AM by DjDemonD.

[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 11, 2018 01:25PM
There must be something wrong with my setup...spinning smiley sticking its tongue out
Attachments:
open | download - Skärmbild från 2018-01-11 22-15-34.png (86.8 KB)
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 11, 2018 01:45PM
Well they are accurate but that might be a false result of some sort. Can you manually issue 30x G30 commands and stick them in a spreadsheet.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 11, 2018 09:38PM
I did put a paper under the probe and then I got a different of 0.1 mm

How hard should you tighten the piezo??
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 12, 2018 12:11AM
If it's measuring the paper correctly it's possible the m48 result is valid. You can preload a piezo disc quite a lot. At a certain point the ceramic breaks.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/12/2018 12:12AM by DjDemonD.

[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 12, 2018 12:29AM
So then I have some tinkering to do...

What specifications on the piezo is recommended..
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 12, 2018 12:35AM
I am not sure what information you need. The piezo disc we use most reliably is murata 7bb, [www.mouser.com]
That's for the 20mm discs.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 12, 2018 08:33AM
it's more or less that information I need... Thanks

I got more trustworthy readings today...


SENDING:M48
M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test

Finished!
Mean: 0.167053 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.004896
>>> m48
SENDING:M48
M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test

Finished!
Mean: 0.166054 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.004997
>>> m48
SENDING:M48
M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test

Finished!
Mean: 0.164055 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.004580
>>> m48
SENDING:M48
M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test

Finished!
Mean: 0.165054 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.004896
>>> m48

Mean: 0.166054 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.004997
>>> m48
SENDING:M48
M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test

Finished!
Mean: 0.164055 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.004580
>>> m48
SENDING:M48
M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test

Finished!
Mean: 0.165054 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.004896
>>> m48
SENDING:M48
M48 Z-Probe Repeatability Test

Finished!
Mean: 0.162056 Min: 0.161 Max: 0.171 Range: 0.010
Standard Deviation: 0.002998
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 12, 2018 08:39AM
That's at the more accurate end of the scale we observe in testing.10 microns range and 4 deviation is a great result and is meaningfully one order of magnitude more accurate than you require to achieve consistent first layers.


[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 12, 2018 01:19PM
Thanks...It feels great. but I have a mess of wires, a angry wife and frustrated kids now... but I hope its worth it..

So, My contraption is created for the Anycubic Kossel (a reprap knock of)

It fits right in.. almost... The hotend must be exchanged to a E3D v6 (minimum the heatsink) but that is no downside..=)



STL:s is here [www.myminifactory.com]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/12/2018 01:26PM by Nitram.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 13, 2018 04:07AM
Looks good. I'll link to it from the site at some point.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2018 04:07AM by DjDemonD.

[www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters. Coming soon PT1000 cartridge sensors plug straight into duet boards.
Published:Inventions
Over the inaccuracy of BL Touch
January 18, 2018 11:08PM
Have you got any of these kits still available for free for testing in order to make up units/test for new printers?


Just finished designing up a set for the Tevo Little Monster to suit the 27mm and 20mm discs and now looking to give it a test run. The design incorporates some heat shielding/insulation as well as keeping the piezo as far away form the heated bed as possible. Initial tests show on the Tevo LM running for 6 hours with a bed temp of 150 * Celsius and full enclosure with air temp of 60* Celsius the piezo is not exceeding 39 degrees (keeping in mind the ambient room temp is 32* Celsius to begin with). The piezo disc I bought locally seems to have plenty of trigger sensativity with the springs I am using for bed levelling (springs are out of AA battery holder spring for the negative side of the battery). The only downside is the lack of access to readily available 40mm M2 bolts, or should i say you have to purchase a pack of 50 from china for $10AUD which adds to the $50AUD for piezo board.




The lower part is attached using existing M5 thread in the bottom plate outside the printer and holds the piezo via a screw in cap. It is printed with only 15% infill with a full layer every 5 layers at 0.8 layer height and does touch the plate with the bulk of the part (except the thread), this ensures maximum insulation from the heat. The M2 bolt then runs down through from the top to allow you to set the initial pressures and height of the piezo triggering which of course can also be used to fine tune the sensitivity on top of any adjustment of the board (i.e. you can leave an air gap between M2 and piezo, or just touching or add a little pressure). With the stainless bolt I am using I am not getting more than a couple of degrees of heat coming down into the piezo chamber from the 60 degree air temp in the enclosed print chamber so no issues with heat transfer there.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/19/2018 08:59PM by Redemptioner.
Re: Precision Piezo bounty
January 20, 2018 01:22AM
Unfortunately this bounty is no longer available, we sent out the ten kits and received great results.

If you would like to share your designs we would be happy to help with development in any way we can.

Idris

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/20/2018 01:23AM by Moriquendi.

{Precision Piezo} Accurate, repeatable, versatile z-probe plus piezo discs, endstop cables, pt100, 50w heaters.
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